001 Why We Can’t Keep Quiet Anymore – Brutal Honesty, Big Questions, and Zero Bullshit

Welcome 👋🏼

We’re Jo and Natasha, and this is the first ever episode of "Life’s a SHITSHOW." If you’re looking for polite, polished, PR-friendly chat, you’re in the wrong place. We’re here for brutal honesty, big questions, and saying the shit most people are too scared to say out loud.

If you catch us looking down, don’t panic - we’re not googling, just making sure we don’t forget the important stuff. We’re paper girls at heart and this conversation matters.

Episode Summary 📝

A few weeks back, we talked about doing something together, a podcast, a project, whatever. We said we’d think on it and come back to it. Then Charlie Kirk was assassinated, and honestly, it hit us like we’d lost a family member. That was it: we woke up and said, “We’re ready to speak, and we’re ready to listen.” We all need to be Charlie now.

We’re not money-driven, we’re purpose-driven. We’ve always had this fire for justice, and seeing what happened to Charlie, someone shot for having an opinion - was the final straw. We’ve spent years biting our tongues, but fuck it, we can’t do that anymore. We need to talk, and more importantly, we need to listen.

This isn’t about politics, it’s about being human. We’re mums, we’re grandparents, we’re people who give a shit about the world our kids are growing up in. We’re sick of the bullshit, the fake outrage, the endless division. It’s time for honest conversation - even if it’s uncomfortable.

Key Takeaways 💡

🔥 Brutal honesty is our starting point.
We’re not here to please everyone. We’re here to say what needs saying - even if it pisses people off.

👂 Listening matters as much as speaking.
Real listening means wanting to learn, not just waiting for your turn to talk. We’ve all been guilty of arguing for the sake of it, but it’s time to do better.

😡 Fear, ego, and emotional control are why we’re so divided.
People are scared, wound up, and desperate to be right. The media stirs shit up, and we all end up shouting instead of thinking. We’re calling it out.

🤷‍♀️ No one gets to go through life without being offended.
We can’t keep silencing people just because we don’t agree. Debate is healthy- violence is not.

👶 We owe the next generation better.
We want our kids and grandkids to be brave, to speak up, and to listen - even when it’s hard. That starts with us.

Resources & Links 🔗

• Join the Facebook group: Life’s a SHITSHOW (Working title, but fuck it, it fits.)
• Message us your thoughts, feedback, or rants, public or private. We want all of it.
• Want merch? Let us know - T-shirts coming soon, probably with Tash’s mouth on them.

Final Thoughts & Action Points🚨

We’re building a space where honesty comes first, and everyone’s voice matters -even if you disagree with us (especially if you disagree with us). If you’re sick of fake, filtered conversations and want to be part of something real, stick around. Join the group, send us your feedback, and let us know what you want us to talk about next.

If you wan

Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/lifesashitshow

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Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUM54nmV343FFp8YkcnZPTw/

Website: https://lifesashitshow.com

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome to Life’s a SHITSHOW – Who Are We?
• 1:15 Why Now? Charlie Kirk, Grief, and the Catalyst
• 3:01 Purpose Over Money – What Drives Us
• 4:29 Peace vs. Activism – Can We Be Both?
• 6:14 Old School Values, New World Problems
• 8:23 Losing Trust in People – Why We’ve Withdrawn
• 10:35 Why Jo & Natasha? How This Duo Happened
• 13:35 The Impact of Violence on Free Speech
• 17:38 Standing in the Middle – Not Left, Not Right, Just Human
• 22:41 What We Can Actually Control
• 23:12 What Does Real Listening Look Like?
• 26:20 Why Are We So Quick to Cancel Each Other?
• 28:23 Fear, Ego, and Emotional Control – The Real Dividers
• 36:00 Labels, Identity, and the Danger of Missing Context
• 45:03 Parenting, Regret, and Second Chances as Grandparents
• 50:09 Owning Our Shit – The Uncomfortable Truth
• 56:32 Building a Real Community – No Bullshit Allowed
• 1:01:22 Wrapping Up – What’s Next for Life’s a SHITSHOW?

Transcript

Life's a SHITSHOW Season 1 EP01

[00:00:00] Jo : Tash, I have prepared a list of questions, I'm gonna lead with the questions. and chip in as you are answering them as well. Just so there's a bit more order to what we're doing. 

[00:00:11] Natasha: Yeah. I just want to pre-warn everyone. I do have notes in front of me that I'll probably check because anyone that knows me will know my memory is rubbish. Tonight is a really important. Conversation. So there's certain things I wanted to make sure I remembered to say. So if I look down or I mess about with notes, 

[00:00:30] that's why I'm not Googling. I'm not Googling, I'm paper girl, me paper girl. I just want to make sure that I cover everything I want to cover.

[00:00:40] But yeah.

[00:00:41] Yeah. 

[00:00:42] Jo : Okay. , I'm gonna kick off then, Tash. So a few weeks ago, you asked me about the potential of us doing something together. And I left and came back home and we agreed that in a few months time we'd get our heads back together and see if we couldn't kick a few ideas about. And then yesterday morning when I woke up after what happened. With Charlie Kirk being assassinated, it really hit me like I'd lost a family member. 

[00:01:15] Natasha: I think so many people felt like that. Even people that weren't avid followers 

[00:01:22] I

[00:01:23] Jo : didn't sleep much that night. I was watching Katie Hopkins the Katie's arms livestream, and somebody had commented on that livestream. Charlie Kirk's been shot. I immediately left the livestream and went to find the news, what the hell was going on? 

[00:01:41] And then I was just caught up in it for the whole evening. Couldn't quite believe it. And I woke up the next morning and voice clipped you and said, I'm ready now.

[00:01:52] I'm ready to listen and I'm ready to speak.

[00:01:57] Natasha: Yeah.

[00:01:58] Jo : Even really thought it through. 

[00:01:59] What was the moment? So prior to that, I think this has been the catalyst, Charlie's assassination for me. Certainly the catalyst will for both of us. That's what's given me the kick up the backside to get it going. But what was the moment for you where you realized that there was, this was something that you wanted to do, and was there a specific trigger or feeling that made it real for you?

[00:02:20] Natasha: So predominantly what happened, god, I don't even know what day it was that i've, I feel like the last couple of days has just been a complete blur. Was it Wednesday we yesterday.

[00:02:31] Jo : Wednesday. It happened Friday today. Yeah.

[00:02:34] Natasha: Wednesday evening that I found out. So as you say, we'd spoken now for, I saw you a few weeks back. But months prior to that, I have been going backwards and forwards, feeling like I want to get back out there a little bit. But, i've been, umming and arrring about in what way I go forward in terms of what I want to do for a living, what I want to do as a career or do 

[00:03:01] I knew I wanted to have my own thing again. I wanted to work for myself in some way, but I am not a money driven person. I'm a purpose driven person. And everything I do, there has to be, I have to feel that I'm making a difference somewhere. To someone. Yeah. Or a cause or something, 

[00:03:17] I don't know. 

[00:03:18] Jo : I used to believe I was money driven task for a long time, 

[00:03:21] Natasha: money brings choices and yeah, money means you can provide for your kids and not have to worry. Of course. I think we all be liars. No, I do it all for free, but I genuinely, there's certain things that I would do for free. 

[00:03:33] And the one thing I think I learned a long time ago was do the thing that you would happily do for free.

[00:03:40] Jo : Yeah.

[00:03:40] Natasha: So for me it was, it's always about purpose and I have to feel that I'm making a difference. I'm a little bit of an activist. I think the way the world is at the moment calls for that. But I've been held back by the feeling of I'm in a really peaceful time in my life. It's the calmest, if it's ever been, I'm the calmest I've ever been. I don't get as emotionally charged like I used to. I've got young grandchildren that I, and my kids, and I just love the peaceful life. My circle is very small now. I'm not out there with the bravado and the big group of friends at the pub, and I kept thinking if I go out and I do anything, I'm all or nothing kind of person.

[00:04:29] So I know that as soon as I click that record button, or as soon as I put out that post for anything, whatever that is, I'm back in the spotlight. I'm back being judged. I'm back being, having to deal with bullshit. 

[00:04:41] Can I be arsed?.

[00:04:42] Jo : Yeah.

[00:04:43] Natasha: Can I be asked? It's gonna bring, it's just gonna bring bullshit into my nice, calm life. But I have always been from a very young age, defiant. I have a real strong sense of justice. I don't like injustice. I don't like, things not being fair, and I've not liked what I've seen going on in the world for a long time. I also like to think that I am not all one way or all the other. I've been a liberal most of my life. All of my life. I was raised very liberal. I have never been a conservative thinker particularly, but I was raised quite old school and I'm almost certain, and I see it a lot where most of us are like that Gen X generation. We are very fair. We care about the vulnerable. We want to see people supported, but hold yourself accountable for the shit you do wrong.

[00:05:40] Like certain manners are just expected. You don't get respect without giving it. It's those old school traditional values. And I'm at a point, as I'm sure most people are, where I know I'm a good person at the core of it, but I'm getting pissed off at what I'm seeing. I'm getting angry at what I'm seeing. And it's not the individual particularly, it's what I see happening long term and how. Shapes the future for my children, for your children, for your grandchildren. I don't like what I see.

[00:06:14] And I and what happened to Charlie, and I will say this so that everyone knows this as well. I don't dislike Charlie.. I would really only see the shorter videos of things that he did and some of his debates I loved. And I was like, yeah, he is. I'm very much about truth. I don't care how uncomfortable it is.

[00:06:35] Truth is truth. You don't get to make up the facts. You don't get to, you don't get to soften the blow because you can't handle fact. So in that respect, I had so much respect for Charlie Kirk because in a world that is just so fucking fake, everything around us is just fake.

[00:06:55] Jo : Yeah.

[00:06:56] Natasha: I find it very difficult to operate in those environments.

[00:06:59] Jo : Facts became offensive and really concentrated during COVID. , 

[00:07:04] Natasha: I think it started more so for most people then.

[00:07:07] Jo : Yeah. So I was labeled so many things during COVID I've been labeled an anti-vaxxer, I've killed granny.

[00:07:15] I've done all kind of things because very early on, yeah. All the signs that something not quite right here 

[00:07:24] Natasha: As many people did. As many people did. And you know what? Even I think, this is the catalyst I think from 2020. I was already years before that. Yeah. I was very much oh God, do people like the media brainwashing, but this is bullshit or whatever.

[00:07:40] And I could see through certain things, and this wasn't, this hasn't just happened in the last five years. It's happened over, probably over the last 20, 

[00:07:50] right? 

[00:07:50] Jo : Yeah.

[00:07:51] Natasha: In drips and drabs, it wasn't anything that I was concerned about. I trusted that most people in the world had common sense. I trusted that most people in the world would always behave a certain way.

[00:08:04] And I think the last five years, predominantly the last 12 months, it has got to a point, and I'm gonna be really honest. 'cause people that know me and have known me a while will know that I used to love big social gatherings. I love parties. I love people. I loved people. I have despised people.

[00:08:23] I have not wanted to be around the general public. I don't want to leave my house. I rarely do unless I know where I'm going and I know that I'm gonna be in an environment where people are honest. I cannot operate, I don't feel comfortable, safe in environments where I don't know what the crack is. 

[00:08:41] Jo : Yeah, 

[00:08:42] Natasha: I like honest people.

[00:08:43] I like people who will tell me something I don't want to hear, but they will tell me because it's the truth. 

[00:08:50] Jo : Yeah. 

[00:08:50] Natasha: And it becomes, if you are someone that is really rooted in that, it becomes really hard to the point where it will physically affect you to be around too much bullshit. And I think the older, as I'm getting older as well, I'm now 46, I'm starting to go through perimenopause.

[00:09:12] I've got more life experience now. I've got different perceptions on things and I'm now starting to really be just very, I will not deal with that. 

[00:09:23] Jo : Yeah. 

[00:09:24] Natasha: I won't be around that. I won't pretend to the point where I'll even send customer service emails and I'll just be like, are you gonna gimme a refund or not?

[00:09:30] Let's just cut crap. I'm at that point. Yeah. Cut the bullshit out. That's where I've been at. We then met up for the first time in nine years, we got together. 'cause obviously you live abroad, Jo. Yeah. And it was so lovely to see you that day. But I'd been in a position where I was like, I really want to do this thing.

[00:09:49] I don't really know what it's gonna look like, but I know I want to do something. And I felt at a certain point I think I need someone to do it with. But I don't know who's the right person for that. And I had this gut feeling to just throw out. I hadn't thought it through. It was just blur out have a brain dump on Jo and see what happens from that conversation. And I kind of blurbed, I've got this idea, maybe something like this. But you know what do you think?

[00:10:15] And you came back with, I love that. Like that's, this is it. And I could hear in your voice, oh my God. And I was like, this is, it's fucking Jo. It's Jo. I've had to wait for Jo and then I got excited. Now back to Charlie.

[00:10:35] I am gonna find this difficult to talk about, and it's not because I want people to be clear. It's not because I'm trying to make him a martyr or a hero or anything like that. I wasn't like a huge fan.

[00:10:49] We watched a man shot in the neck. And die in front of us because be under no illusion. I don't care how long they longed that out for. That man probably died instantly that he wasn't surviving that.

[00:11:04] And all of my worst fears in that moment became a reality. And that was, I've been teaching my children. My kids are, I've got a 27-year-old daughter, 23-year-old daughter, and an almost 17-year-old son.

[00:11:22] They're good kids. And I've been teaching them from day one to speak up, to stand up for what they believe is right, to not be scared, to speak their opinions, even if other people don't agree.

[00:11:39] And then I watch the man get shot for that.

[00:11:42] And listen, this is where I'm gonna be brutally honest with people. I don't give a fuck if you liked him or not. I don't give a fuck if you agreed with him or not. No one gets to go through life without being offended. No one gets to go through life and everyone agreeing with them.

[00:11:58] Jo : Exactly. 

[00:12:00] Natasha: But I never saw that man aggressively attack anyone. I never saw him violent with anyone. I never saw him pull a gun on anyone. I never saw him wrestle anyone to the floor and demand that they think the same as him. He may well have had controversial opinions, but do you know what every single person that's gonna watch this so have you to someone else?

[00:12:24] Jo : Yeah. 

[00:12:25] Natasha: Your opinion to someone else will be controversial. Your view on something will be controversial to someone else. How arrogant do you have to be to think that the way you think or your opinion on the topic? A, is right. We can all believe we, we are right, but to be so right that somebody else deserves to be shot in front of his children and college students, these are young adults starting out in life, we are, we as adults are supposed to, schools are supposed to encourage critical thought, expanding ideas, open-mindedness, creativity but you get reprimanded for asking questions in school or you get shot. In front of people for standing up for your opinions or debating people. It sickened me. And that was the point for me where I thought I just, couldn't describe how I felt. It affected me more than I thought it would.

[00:13:35] Jo : Yeah, same.

[00:13:36] Natasha: And I couldn't work out. Why? Because let's be honest, we've seen a lot of death and destruction this last few years. I couldn't work out why It bothered me. Really bothered me. And like you, I didn't sleep much. I was reading comments on social media, seeing Charlie Kirk said this, Charlie Kirk said that.

[00:13:55] So I was spending the evening watching. Did he say that? And in what context? 'cause I know what people are like. They miss out the context. Yeah.

[00:14:04] Jo : Tina's just saying the school system doesn't actually promote free thinking. Unfortunately. 

[00:14:09] Natasha: It doesn't. It doesn't. I've got many life experience examples of that with my own children, where I have, I've fought for them.

[00:14:18] I've had a call from when my eldest daughter was in secondary school in an re lesson in a Catholic school. And the reason she went to a Catholic school, I'm not a religious person. The reason she went to a Catholic school was for the discipline because I felt for that child, she needed the discipline.

[00:14:35] She needed to be in a mixed school. And I wanted her out of my town. It's only just out of the town, but I wanted her to mix with kids from a different area as well. I didn't want her just in the town. And she got reprimanded because she, they were asking an re lesson with, had any questions and she put her hand up.

[00:14:53] And she said, how do you know that God is real? Which I think for a 12, 13-year-old is a perfectly reasonable question, but of course the teacher could not answer that. So rather than say, do you know what, that's a great question and I'm glad you asked and I actually don't know the answer. So what I can do is guide you in finding the answer for yourself.

[00:15:22] Yeah. So that you come to a place where you feel happy with your opinion, your view, your belief. That's what should have happened. What happened was she got detention. Yeah. And I off, I kicked off. And back then I wasn't able to control my emotions at all. In any situation, I get very passionate and that comes out very aggressively.

[00:15:46] And I thought, no, fuck this. No. How dare you like squash this in her so young? No, she's asking questions. She's not being rude. Your job as a teacher is to educate if you don't know the answer to something. Be honest. Yeah. Show her how to find it for herself. 

[00:16:07] Jo : its reminded me of that movie and I can't think what it's called, but he's Santa Claus and the girl that played Matilda was like he was showing everybody that he was the real Santa Claus and then they were gonna put him in the nuthouse he was in, there was a whole court case and then there was the dollar note that said, in God, we trust 

[00:16:27] It just reminded me of that like it was printed on every dollar bill in America in God we trust. We can't prove it. But 

[00:16:36] Natasha: listen I respect anyone's right to believe whatever they want. I don't personally follow religion, but I understand the need to feel, like there is something greater in times, in hard times.

[00:16:52] My belief is that the people I've lost that I loved my nan especially, I have to tell myself in dark times, my nan is there, my nan's here, I don't know if my nan's there or not, but that's what makes me feel at peace. If someone was to say to me, Tash you know, like that, that's not real, I'd be like, do you know what it might not be. Yeah. But I'm not gonna ram it down your throat. I'm not gonna force you, you have to tell me it's real, or I'm going to have you lose your job.

[00:17:23] Jo : Joanne. Yeah. We all lean into what gives us comfort, Jo. Of course.

[00:17:27] Natasha: That should be respected. But there is no place for that in and this, listen, I am speaking I, to everyone, I need to be really clear.

[00:17:38] I'm speaking from someone stood in the middle. I'm not speaking as a liberal, I'm not speaking as a conservative, fuck the politics, right? I'm speaking from someone in the middle. I'm speaking as a mum, as a human, being, a grandparent, as someone that is concerned for what I'm seeing, playing out in front of me.

[00:17:59] Yeah. And so I sat yesterday morning and it's funny because just before you messaged me yesterday morning, I was sitting there thinking that what happened to Charlie Kirk is going to stop so many people, is gonna stop people from wanting to speak up about controversial topics.

[00:18:20] Predominantly,

[00:18:20] Jo : it lit a fire in my belly and the only thing it did for me was make me believe that these people who are weaponizing language and when they can't win the argument, they can't win the debate. They haven't got the facts and figures, and they just literally can't win that stance because evidence and science or whatever is not on their side in that particular instance.

[00:18:47] They think the only answer is violence. And then sadly, in Charlie's case, shooting him to death it's 

[00:18:55] Natasha: what's happened to Charlie? Do you know what, it's not a shock. It shouldn't shock any of us because we have literally been watching this play out. We had an MP in this country couple of years ago.

[00:19:06] Was his name. Oh God. Was it David. David Amis. He was in his constituency holding a constituency, he was stabbed to death. 

[00:19:18] Yeah. 

[00:19:19] What we have been warned. We have seen this happen. I also want to thingy that there was in June there was a Democratic politician and her husband, Melissa Hortman, she was shot in her home, her husband, who was a senator, I believe. I don't mind being corrected on that, but I believe he was a senator, democratic senator, and he was also shot dead in their home. 

[00:19:46] Jo : Yeah. 

[00:19:47] Natasha: So we had the warning, the warning was there. It wasn't important enough. I think where I see people say, oh, but don't forget this Melissa, and don't forget this person too.

[00:19:57] It's not just about, it's listen, the reason people have reacted about Charlie is because he had the view,

[00:20:03] Jo : he had the platform.

[00:20:04] Natasha: We watched it happen. 

[00:20:06] Jo : Yeah. And Turning Point was in the UK as well

[00:20:09] Natasha: we watched it happen. Charlie is me and you.

[00:20:11] Yeah. I was people that will remember this, that knew me back in 2016, 2017, 2018. I ended up with BBC journalists on my doorstep because I went so hard for what I believed in and what I believed was the right thing to do. I went against people that I had worked with and were friends with. Yeah.

[00:20:34] I went against their industry and I went hard and I would not let it go because it was the right thing to do for me. Yeah. Now, there was lots of people at that time that thought I was disgusting. They thought I was trying to destroy individuals, take their businesses down because obviously they didn't like what I was saying and it affected them.

[00:20:57] But I'm not a bad person and I was doing what I believed to be Right. And I still do believe that to be right. But of course there was a lot of people that were pissed at me. They're allowed to be That's fine. What they're not allowed to do is shoot me. Exactly. So when I watch Charlie, that is me.

[00:21:19] I am Marmite in my network. People either love me or they hate me. People either agree with me or they don't. 

[00:21:27] Jo : Yeah. Gone. are the days where, I don't know why they've gone. But back in the day when I was younger, we used to go to the pub and we'd have a pint and a glass of wine or whatever, a drink, and you'd have two different teams of football supporters arguing about the debating about the match, but they didn't shoot each other.

[00:21:50] There might have been role now and again, but you could talk about politics in the pub. You could talk about a movie. Somebody might have loved, somebody might have hated social media has played a big part in this.

[00:22:04] Natasha: I think there's many reasons. And some of them I will go over.

[00:22:07] There are a lot of aspects to what's happening right now. It's not just one thing. It's not just, it's not just the government. It's not just the media. It's not just this and that. There's lots of things at play here. Yeah. And I think it's been a, I think it's been a slow burner to get to where we're at.

[00:22:22] What I think is really important to remember is we cannot control a lot of things. Yeah. We can't control what government do. We can't go, we like to think we can, we fucking can't. Let's be honest. We don't have a choice. One big club, we ain't in it. The only thing that we can control.

[00:22:41] It's how we behave,

[00:22:43] Jo : exactly how you behave, how you react.

[00:22:46] Natasha: That's it.

[00:22:47] Jo : Not just how you speak, but how you listen. So I'm going to bring us very nicely to question two. Tash. So we do talk a lot about listening but what does listening actually look like, especially in a world where everyone's just throwing their opinions around? So how do we make sure that we really hearing someone not just waiting for your turn to talk? 

[00:23:12] Natasha: I think the first thing is you have to want to listen.

[00:23:15] Let's start there. If you go in, and I listen, I've done it, I've done it a lot. I've done it a lot I genuinely think you can't listen if you're already coming from a place of I think you have to want to learn. I actually really enjoy it.

[00:23:34] And I'm not saying I do this all the time 'cause I don't, I've been on Twitter in the past and I have gone in and called people, like all sorts. I think I got banned once for calling someone a moronic carrot cruncher or something because she was vegan. And I just wanted to really annoy her and I knew that I would annoy her by offending her with a vegetable related insult, so it was like, yeah, fuck this bitch. She was calling me a pedophile apologist, and I'm like, oh, you carrot crunching the bitch, i'm got fucking banned for that anyway.

[00:24:06] Jo : Yeah. Because people have weaponized words.

[00:24:09] Natasha: But the joke was I was trying not to be an asshole, I was trying not to be aggressive and nasty, but, so I went with the carrot insult, which looking back, carrot, but it depended on my mood.

[00:24:23] There were days when people quite openly got called to C words and I knew I'd get banned for it. I did it anyway 'cause I fuck you, like that's just some days I want to, some days I'm angry and some days I'm more touchy than others. But again, it's, I got to a point, even with that. Where I realize some people are genuinely open to discussion. They want to know more information. 

[00:24:51] Yeah. 

[00:24:51] They go, I don't know, I get a feeling about this girl. I'll get a feeling about this woman. Maybe she doesn't seem like someone that would be easily led. Maybe she knows something I don't. And they would engage in conversation.

[00:25:04] Yeah. And because they did that with me and I respected that I would do the same back. They were wrong. Just want to point that out. They were wrong. But I tend to not go into like arguments with people if I don't know enough about the topic as well. 

[00:25:25] Jo : That's an interesting word You've just chose to use there arguments with people 

[00:25:30] Natasha: because sometimes I do enjoy the argument, Jo.

[00:25:33] I'd be a liar if I said I didn't, if I've had a shit day. I used to sit on Twitter for about five hours in the evening. For fun to relax. Just wind up all the trolls. Yeah. And I won't, being angry with them, I would just be sarcastic and I'd be laughing to myself going, Tash you're an asshole. You're an actual asshole. If I was talking to me on Twitter, I would punch me in the face, I was like, you are someone that I would want to punch in the face sometimes, but listen, we are human, we are flawed. We do these things. I don't ever mean anything in a, I'm never most of the time I'm just having a bit of a laugh, or I just like to make someone feel a dick when they've acted like a dick.

[00:26:17] I think we're all like that. 

[00:26:19] Yeah. Most of us. 

[00:26:20] Jo : I'm gonna jump ahead. One question. So why do you think that we've become so quick to shut each other down instead of just having a proper discussion? What do you think is behind the urge to silence or cancel people rather than actually listening? 

[00:26:37] Natasha: I made notes on this question. 

[00:26:38] Yeah, 

[00:26:39] because I, this is probably for me one of the most important questions that you wanted to ask and I think it's one of the most important things for people to hear. So bear with me 'cause I want to make sure that I articulate this and I don't go off track. I had I really thought about this and I thought, what do I feel?

[00:27:01] I say three or four of the most important things in terms of how we can change, how we can start to make a bit of a change with how we. How we're all behaving right now.

[00:27:12] And I thought, what fundamentally breaks down, like what's not there when you are watching social media, debates, discussions, whatever, even the way that societies with government, the way media behave, what is missing?

[00:27:28] Yeah. That makes it so ridiculous at this point. And I, I believe, and obviously I could be wrong, feel free to tell me because 

[00:27:38] Freedom Speak, right? 

[00:27:39] Jo : There's a couple of comments in the chat perhaps let me sharing with you. So it comes with always having to be in defense mode because social media has destroyed the art of conversation.

[00:27:48] That's from Joanne and Tina saying, yes, Joanne, open discourse respect, listening to understand so many people are missing these qualities. 

[00:28:00] Natasha: That's interesting. 

[00:28:01] So I tried to strip everything away when I thought about the answer for this because it's like putting a plaster over something. I would rather get right to the, what is the first thing that needs to change before anything else can change, before social media can change, before you know all of this stuff.

[00:28:23] And I believe that this is it. I think that people act and respond for the most part. And the reason that people are so divided part and there's four parts to this. One is fear and that shows up in ways like the Muslims are gonna take over and kill us all. Trans people will hear someone say biology matters.

[00:28:47] And what they hear is. They want to take all my rights away. 

[00:28:52] Yep. 

[00:28:53] It's that immediate, it's fear. And what fuels that is a shitty media. Every one, every, all of them. All of them. None of them. I don't trust any of them. They are all shitty people. If you now as a job want to be a news reader for BBC, you are a dick.

[00:29:16] Jo : Yeah. 

[00:29:16] Natasha: Honestly, you're a dick. 'cause I, if I, if somebody said to me, now, what do you want to do? And I was like, and I wanted to be a journalist when I was younger, I really wanted to be a journalist. If somebody says to me now, do you want to go and work for Fox News? Do you want to go and work for, BBC, do I fuck No thanks, because at some point, and I don't care, you could offer me a hundred thousand pound a week.

[00:29:38] I wouldn't do it. I, on my life, I wouldn't do it because how can you sit, 

[00:29:44] Jo : you don't need knowing we've got a platform, everybody has the right to a voice and a platform. We can share what our thoughts and opinions are. It doesn't mean people have to agree with us. We respect, we share everybody's voice.

[00:29:59] Natasha: But that's very different to media because our job is not to do what a journalist's job is. To do. A journalist's job in the media's role, or should be, is to hold authority to account. Yeah. And things are in the public interest to report factually and accurately. They are not working for you. They're not working for the cause. They don't give a shit. And, but now the company as a whole is one thing. But the individual that sits behind that camp or sits in front of that camera knowing, it's that knowing that what they're saying is a deliberate presented in a deliberate way.

[00:30:43] COVID again, is a prime example. Constant repetitive. Death. I'm sitting there thinking, tell me how many people didn't die today? Yeah. Tell me how people, how many people had COVID and didn't die today? I know what you're doing here. And there were so many petrified people, which then had the knock on effect of how people behave going forward.

[00:31:03] So we start with fear. The next thing is ego. 

[00:31:09] Yeah. I struggle with this too. Ego. People 

[00:31:14] cannot or will not even comprehend that they may have been lied to, they may have been fooled, that they could be gullible, that they could have fallen for something. Now, listen, I'm better now than I used to be in terms of look for the bloody facts first fact check right before you share something.

[00:31:37] But I am still guilty now and again, of just being right. Yeah. In the moment, oh, I want to, oh, I want to be right 'cause this person's pissing me off. Or just let him, just letting it get better at me and ego creeps in there. And if somebody is trying to tell me something, for the most part I'm not like that.

[00:32:00] It happens because again I'm just trying to do better than I was doing yesterday, or last week or last year. And I am getting there, but I'm not perfect. I'm floored like everyone else. So ego is a problem. People just don't want to accept. They might be wrong because they will feel foolish and it's embarrassment.

[00:32:21] Yeah. So stupid 

[00:32:23] Jo : Tash Tina's saying, your ego is not your amigo. 

[00:32:27] Natasha: That's brilliant. actually. I love 

[00:32:29] that. I'm gonna get a T-shirt. Yeah, I'm gonna get a T-shirt with that. Your ego is not your amigo and it's gonna wear a Mexican hat. That'll fucking offend someone now, no doubt. The next thing, emotional control.

[00:32:41] Emotions. Emotions, because this leads to two really important things. If you immediately let your emotions, I am actually very good at not letting strangers on the internet control my emotions. Yeah. In real everyday life, somebody could say something and I just erupt. I do. I rarely now, but it does happen because I'll just get, and then I can't get back again.

[00:33:08] Jo : It happens hardly ever now with me because I read that book, let them, but let them move me so far to laid back like I'm horizontal. So now I'm like, ah, fuck 'em. Let them. But I'm coming back a little bit more into the middle now of sometimes actually you do just need to tell people you're a fucking moron.

[00:33:32] Natasha: Listen. I feel like that's my duty sometimes is that is my job in life, right? Is to just scroll through the internet and find just stupid people and just tell them that they're stupid. Some days I literally can't help myself. It's, I'm gonna be honest. 'cause there's no point in me sitting on air preaching like, this is how we should be.

[00:33:55] I, yeah. Find it myself, yes, I want to be better. And yes I want to try and do things in a, I don't want to fight people don't want to fight fire with fire. 

[00:34:07] Yeah. 

[00:34:07] Which is what everyone, I'm sure we all feel like we just want to retaliate. Totally understand that, but this does, that doesn't work.

[00:34:15] And we're at a point now, we can't fuck around anymore. We need to find a solution and we need to action it because this is our children's future. 

[00:34:23] Yeah, I don't want to leave them with this shit hole of a world right now. This is not good. And I do still believe that most people are good people. They're just caught in their echo chamber.

[00:34:36] So emotional control, but emotional control. So if you feel yourself reading a comment and you're like, which I've done, just take a minute, take the phone out,

[00:34:47] Jo : take 24 hours, treat it like your Amazon shopping cart

[00:34:50] Natasha: no. I won't wait that long. No, I'm not patient enough to wait that long.

[00:34:54] Jo : I am no long enough. Let them think 

[00:34:58] Natasha: long enough to Just for a second. 

[00:35:02] Jo : Yeah. 

[00:35:02] Natasha: Go back and read again. Because if you let your emotions get better of you in that moment, one, you might misread 

[00:35:10]

[00:35:10] Natasha: What they've said that then leads to your level of comprehension. Because if, listen, I'll tell you the truth here, right? The amount of times that I have said the words a man cannot be pregnant, and what the person hears is I want to kill all trans people and they shouldn't have any fucking rights. No one said that.

[00:35:38] No one said that. 

[00:35:41] Yeah. 

[00:35:41] And even that, even me saying that is gonna offend people. 

[00:35:45] Yeah. 

[00:35:46] Tough. Because that, that, that is the reality. That's an uncomfortable truth. I would be, I would put my life savings on the fact that 99% of the people that watch this will go, that's exactly what happened to me.

[00:36:00] Yeah. That's what it feels like. Because that is the reality. That is the truth of it. Okay. I don't have any issue with trans people, there's problems. Same as every topic with political, whatever you want to bring up. 

[00:36:17] Jo : I've been labeled every phobia.

[00:36:21] Natasha: I laugh. It's wasted on me, Jo, because if you try and shut my conversation down, if you try and shut me down by calling me in that, in, in that argument 

[00:36:31] Jo : Islamophobic, homophobic.

[00:36:33] Natasha: I don't care.

[00:36:34] Jo : Transphobic. I've been called all the phobics all, and I'm like, call me whatever you want. You can call me whatever you want. I, but what I think you're doing don't care, is because you don't know how to have a conversation with me like a civil adult. You just want to label me. I want, 

[00:36:53] Natasha: you want to shut me up.

[00:36:53] Jo : I want to have a conversation over a glass of wine with you like we used to do back in the day. Where we can still be friends and still have a conversation and we can both be right simultaneously. 

[00:37:04] Natasha: Listen, I won't even say that my, my best friend, the guys on here that know my best friend Deb, literally the one person out outside of my kids, the one person in the world that I will always trust that anything she tells me, she's telling me for my benefit, for the good of me as a person, right?

[00:37:24] I trust her so much and I love her dearly. I find criticism difficult. I'm one of those people, ah, don't like it, but as I've got older I've recognized that and I'm, oh, that's a bit of a toxic trait. You need to be, you need to chill. You need to be able to take the criticism. ' cause I love to give it, I don't like being a hypocrite.

[00:37:43] I try not to be a hypocrite where possible. Can't stand hypocrisy. So I try to work on the things that I know is, that are a little bit problematic for me. Now Deb is someone who can tell me anything and I will take it from her. But even then there are times where I think, yeah, fucking a dusty of this bitch.

[00:38:05] Who does she think she is? I'm not saying out loud mine 'cause Deb scares the shit outta me. Yeah. And she's got a hard punch. So I don't say out loud obviously, I just say it quietly to myself in my head. But I'm saying it in, and it's a second. It's a second. I, where I feel a little bit, I feel a little bit like, yeah. 

[00:38:25] Jo : Let me share this in the chat. So Jo saying words really matter,

[00:38:31] Natasha: comprehension. Comprehension, and comprehension then leads to the attitude in which you respond. Yeah. 

[00:38:37] Jo : She's saying toxic labels are really dangerous. It's what killed Charlie.

[00:38:41] They refer yes to him as right wing influencer. He's not, he's a conservative commentator 

[00:38:47] Natasha: Emotions affect comprehension. Comprehension affects the attitude in which you respond and your logical brain, and you learn this in sales 

[00:38:58] Jo : Yeah. Logic 

[00:38:59] Natasha: idea in sales is to switch off the logical brain, engage the emotional brain.

[00:39:05] There is a reason that the media do the exact same thing. They want you to buy their story. 

[00:39:12] Jo : Yeah. 

[00:39:13] Natasha: Right now. These are manipulative things. These are all playing a part in how we as individuals respond, discuss debate. 

[00:39:24] Yep. 

[00:39:25] Say shit!. And also, and I'm gonna, while I think of it, we have got to stop expecting human beings to be fucking perfect.

[00:39:37] Bringing up tweets and posts that someone did 10 years ago and having them lose their job today.

[00:39:44] Jo : I shared a story on Instagram. It was something that I've seen pop up. It was just writing and it basically said, with all due respect, if you haven't spoken to me for nine months, you have no idea who I am.

[00:39:57] Natasha: That part,

[00:39:58] Jo : people change. That part they grow. And who I was last year is not the same person as who I am now, or 

[00:40:07] Natasha: I'm not the same person now Jo, as I was at Christmas. 

[00:40:10] Jo : Exactly. She was Joanne saying they called Candice Owens, a Hitler sympathizer by purposely removing context from what she actually said.

[00:40:20] Natasha: Yeah, I saw that. I watched Canice Owens was someone I didn't like, did not like, and I would've joined in conversation online going, oh yeah, she's horrible. Yeah. And then I started to listen to what she was actually saying and I was like, oh, she ain't wrong though. I'll tell you something controversial and I, I'll get a lot of stick for this.

[00:40:41] Andrew Tate, I don't like him as a person. want to make that clear? I think he's an arrogant, egotistical dick, but. A lot of what he says is uncomfortable truth that no one wants to hear. Even, and I can say this from a personal point of view, in my twenties I was, I can be a mom and have a career. I can have it all.

[00:41:07] Feminism now at 46, having had right now the least amount of money I've ever had, the quietest life I've had, the least amount of friends I've ever had. The least amount of social life I've ever had. I have never been happier. 

[00:41:23] Yeah. 

[00:41:23] Because I'm at home with my kids and my grandkids, and I'm of an age where I can appreciate all the things that I wish I'd have appreciated.

[00:41:34] In my twenties when they were little, I would not swap that. 

[00:41:41] For a high powered career and lots of money I wouldn't promise you. But this, that you can have both this lie that you can raise great kids and be completely fulfilled as a mother and have a high powered, successful career is bullshit. Something will be half-assed

[00:42:01] listen, it's it hits the guilt it gives you the guilt feels the mum guilt because it's true.

[00:42:08] Jo : I was in corporate at high profile, corporate career, three children. My three kids were parented through gifting. So I used to be working away.

[00:42:22] I'd send Beckii in my daughter sorry I'm not there for your birthday gift the night before a birthday. I won't be here for your birthday. So here's the, sorry, I won't be here for your birthday gift. Then she'd have a birthday gift. Then another gift. 'cause I've been working away. Like literally they had everything that they wanted because I had my career 

[00:42:43] success.

[00:42:44] Yeah. 

[00:42:45] Grew up without the mum. I was there at weekends occasionally, but I was there when it was too late and now they've grown up and it really is too late because. I never went. One si three kids. Tash never went one single parent's evening. I never went any of the Christmas plays or any, anything at all.

[00:43:07] I was, yeah, a career parent. You can't have both. And looking back now, I'm like, those years have gone, 

[00:43:13] Natasha: At the time you were doing all of that because you wanted to give your kids a good life. Yeah. Doing it for them.

[00:43:21] work came first.

[00:43:22] Jo : I wish I'd had that time with them because time's the one commodity that we haven't got. I can always make more money. I can't get more time. Yeah. It's the one single commodity that's, you never know how much of it you've got. 

[00:43:38] Natasha: my only regret as a mother now is that I wish I'd have I wish I'd have sought this wisdom from somebody older.

[00:43:50] I wish I'd have spoken to my nan more about what she regretted as a mum once she got to a certain age. I wish I'd have, I wish I'd have known this information because, 

[00:43:59] yeah, 

[00:44:01] I say I would've done better, would I? I was 20 years old, 18 years old, with no idea and just doing my best. I think I, when Andrew Tate says things like, women really don't feel properly fulfilled, for the most part, this is not all women.

[00:44:18] There's gonna be women that don't thingy with that. Of course, there is like everything, but for the most part, if we're really honest. And someone said to you, would you rather have a fantastic marriage where your husband goes out to work and earns really good money that you stay at home and raise your children and run that home?

[00:44:40] Oh, I would bite your hand off for that. Now. 

[00:44:43] Jo : I'd rip their arm off. 

[00:44:44] Natasha: I would bite your hand off for that. To be able to go back and do it that way. 

[00:44:47] Yeah. 

[00:44:48] And just, yes. Yes. Because that's the bit that gives me the most fulfillment. Even now my children are oh, and I feel constantly like I need to make up for things I didn't give them when I should have 

[00:45:02] done

[00:45:03] Jo : tash, I'm gonna bring us to the last question 'cause we're at the hour point, so we're gonna have wrap up. But do you feel like you are putting more into being a grandparent than you did into a parent? I know I do like with Charlie, like my first grandson and Finley, like they're I feel like I'm putting so much effort sitting, playing board games with them, reading bedtime stories, 

[00:45:27] Natasha: conscious effort. Conscious effort. That's what it's not that I'm putting more effort into them, it's that I'm putting more conscious effort into them. I am very aware of how my words are going to affect them as adults.

[00:45:40] I'm very aware I think my eldest daughter, your first born is always the one that gets the worst version of you as a parent. Bless them.

[00:45:48] Jo : Yeah, absolutely.

[00:45:49] Natasha: They'll also be the ones that are the most capable in life. A little bit of trauma is good. No, I'm joking. I'm joking, but no, 'cause my youngest can't do fuck all.

[00:45:57] But anyway, so the eldest one gets the worst version of you. Now, when my daughter would come to me, I was 18 when I became a mom. When my eldest daughter would come to me, we'd say, period pain at 13. And she'd want a hug. And she's a very compassionate girl. She's a, she, she's a hug girl. My role as a mom in that mindset at 18 because of my life experience, was she's going into a real tough world.

[00:46:25] I need to prepare her. She needs to be tough. She needs to be able to roll her sleeves up. So my reaction to my 13-year-old, 12-year-old, 13-year-old in agony, just wanting a mum hug was take a cup, paracetam, and stop fucking moaning. Life ain't easy for women. Deal with it. That was me. You ask you, I'll tell you, any of you that know my eldest child you know what I'm talking about.

[00:46:54] That poor girl. That poor girl. Now with my next daughter. I was a little you tend to, with the second one, you're a bit more chill. The second one that most people will say, I'm going to enjoy the baby bit. I'm not in a rush for them to walk and talk. And because, oh, it goes so quick. That's the bit you concentrate on and then you shove 'em under your arm and just crack on with your day.

[00:47:19] You don't tend to care so much. That's why that one starts walking later, starts talking later. Because you get the eldest kids, pass your sister a toy the middle child. Don't give a fuck. You've got, if you, any of you have got middle children that now have grown up, I bet they just don't give a shit about anything.

[00:47:33] They don't care. Now the youngest one, the third one, I love them. I've got a youngest son, which is the worst order to have them in, I might say, because that boy because by that time, my youngest is 16, my eldest is 27. I was very conscious of how things play out and how they will affect him.

[00:47:59] Yeah. So I kept so much more out of his environment. My thoughts and feelings for his dad kept it away from him. And it's not a coincidence that he's not an angry kid. He's a beautiful kid. He's sensitive, but he would not know how to work the washing machine. And he did once put noodles in a plastic jug in a microwave and didn't put any water in it.

[00:48:23] And he wants to go to university. So we'll see how that pans out over the years. But the point is, we, when we know better, we try to do better. Now with my grandchildren, I'm, what I'm conscious of now are things I didn't think about. I tell my granddaughter all the time how beautiful she is. 

[00:48:37] Yeah.

[00:48:38] Don't need to. 'cause she's a sassy little mare and she'll tell you herself. Her answer to that is, I know. 

[00:48:43] Yeah. 

[00:48:44] How amazing. 

[00:48:46] Jo : Language is important. 

[00:48:48] Natasha: Very. My, my grandson plays football. He's only seven. He plays football and I try where possible to be present at those games, at the trainings and to encourage him and to tell him the truth.

[00:49:02] Yeah. 

[00:49:02] You are going to have to work hard and sacrifice if this is what you want to do. You're gonna have to sacrifice parties that your friends are going to, you are gonna have to think about what you eat. I don't lie to them. But I'm very conscious that everything I say is going to make a difference. I'm their nan.

[00:49:18] Jo : Yeah. Yeah. Dexy saying, you said about the man working all the time and the woman being in there is the ideal. But my dad has told me many times he regrets. He works so much. But it was how it was. In the eighties, nineties, I had a fabulous childhood and a fond memories of family time. I never felt he wasn't there.

[00:49:41] Natasha: Yeah. Because when he was there, he was probably present. 'cause there was no mobile phones. Yeah. 

[00:49:48] No 

[00:49:48] mobile phones. 

[00:49:48] But that's it. That's for another day. There are so many important I'd love to go deeper into some of these things, but they are going to have to be individual episodes because I, there's just too much.

[00:50:00] To break down, but my, to, to take to sum it up in that sense, if we have to start with ourselves 

[00:50:09] Yeah. 

[00:50:10] The best way to make sure, and we are all guilty of this, and this is an uncomfortable truth that I'm gonna say to everybody on this tonight and anyone listening going forward, the uncomfortable truth for us tonight to accept if we want to preach it, is that we also add fuel to the fire in our own ways.

[00:50:32] On certain days, at certain times with certain topics. We are all guilty of that. We have to address our ego first. If we are happy with where we sit on that, then we have to lead by example. Don't be telling your child. Speak up. Be brave in your opinions while you are hiding behind your fucking kids in a COVID vaccine line.

[00:50:57] Yeah. Don't be throwing your children that during I will say this quickly, 'cause like I said, I won't go into it and I'm not an anti-vaxxer before anyone fucking starts that I don't know anything about. But I'm on the fence on that shit 'cause I haven't read any of it. I don't don't know enough Where COVID specifically was concerned, I watched adults, mothers, fathers, throw in their kids into a vaccine queue because God forbid that their mates on Facebook might tell them off if they didn't or that they might be told off by their neighbors or be looked or lose friends.

[00:51:35] Fuck your friends, your kids come first. There was no way It could have all been bollocks, it could have all been conspiracy bollocks. I wasn't taking the risk to put my son at, I think he was what 12, 13. 12 at the time. He just started secondary school. No chance. Yeah. And I have to live with my decision as a mother, so the whole of society can have an opinion on what I do with my son.

[00:52:03] But what happens as a result of what I do with my son, I have to live with 

[00:52:06] Jo : you. Live with the consequence, not you. Yeah, not you. So Tash, what do you want everybody who's on now, or anybody that may listen to the podcast or watch this on YouTube, what do you want them to take away from this very first episode?

[00:52:22] What sort of conversations do we hope, do you hope that we can inspire in the future By just being open and honest with one another.

[00:52:30] Natasha: I think we all have to learn to be okay with hearing brutal, uncomfortable honesty. Let's start there. 

[00:52:38] Jo : for me it's being conscious of the language that you are using and having conscious conversation. 

[00:52:45] Natasha: Also, is your opinion, or is it regurgitated bullshit from someone else?

[00:52:51] I see that a lot. Yeah. We saw that play out with the Johnny Depp, Amber Heard case. We've seen it play out with Michael Jackson. Allegations. We've seen it play out with COVID. You're just fucking repeating what your mate said because you didn't see it. You didn't watch it. You can't be arsed to read it.

[00:53:10] You can't be arsed to take time outta your day to research it. So you are regurgitating what your pal said and your pal is wrong. Yeah, so now you look stupid. Rather than just go, oh shit, you know what? That's a lesson learned. Oh, I won't do that again. My mates figure as shit, what you'd rather do is double down.

[00:53:29] We've gotta stop doing that. And like I said, I'm not saying this to everyone. I'm not applying this to myself. Exactly the same. But what I want to say to people is I do feel like it's not everyone's, it's not always the individual's fault as to why they're not saying what they really want to say.

[00:53:47] We know, Jo, we've been in the circles, I've been in the industry where I see people play fake as fuck on social media and they are very different people behind closed doors.

[00:53:58] I was told very early on in sales, 

[00:54:00] yeah, stop swearing. Stop swearing on your Facebook. And I said, no. 

[00:54:05] Yeah. 

[00:54:06] I tried it for a little while. I gave me the ick. I'm authentic. I'm cool. If you don't like me, absolutely fine. Not a problem. I wouldn't fucking like me either. I'm a pain in the ass. If you do great, and this is always what's you are going to get always off social media.

[00:54:25] On social media. I'm no different. I will never do anything anonymously. For that reason, I post under my own name in everything because if I'm not prepared to say it and for you to know that I've said it, then I shouldn't be saying it. 

[00:54:40] Yeah. 

[00:54:41] 'Cause I could meet you in the street. 

[00:54:43] Jo : Yeah. So one for another day and it makes you think we need to talk about the mums net saga.

[00:54:49] It's one for Oh, but it affected us both. 

[00:54:52] Natasha: Yeah. Massive. 

[00:54:53] that's a brilliant story though. So people will want to, they will want to hear that. What I do you want to say is what I've done for everyone that's on tonight and whoever listens to this going forward, me and Jo we, we don't know all the, how this is, we all the details yet, but what we have said today, we want this to be, or we want to create, there's a thing when, we sat and we said, when there's something we would like to see in the world and we can't find it, we are gonna create it.

[00:55:22] So what we want to do going forward, we are gonna continue podcast. It'll be random, there'll be lots of random stuff we'll talk about. We will always be honest. I'll always throw. The word fuck in there somewhere because I just can't help myself. And it is a sentence enhancer. Feel free to send a complaint to customer services.

[00:55:41] It will be ignored, but you will feel better about it. No jokes aside. We are, I've created a Facebook group today. I haven't done anything in there. It's just there for anyone that wants to be in that. Let us know because I don't want to I'm not gonna be one of those spammy people let me know. Comment on one of the posts on the page, message the page Message me personally if you've got me on Facebook let us know your thoughts for tonight as well. If you want to keep them private, by all means, please do.

[00:56:11] All we ask is honesty. No matter what, we can take it. It's fine. You say fucking shit, I don't want to see your face on my screen no more at all. Whatever it is, because we want the feedback. 'cause we want to make sure that we are giving people what they want. Otherwise what's the point? But that group I want to, we've said we want to build a community in there.

[00:56:32] A place, I hate the word, like community, it sounds like journey. I'm on a journey. I don't like buzzwords. But anyway, we want to create a space where everyone in there knows that is the one place they can come and be honest about anything or have a rant or have an opinion. But everybody in there has to respect that for everybody else.

[00:56:55] It is not just about you being able to share your opinions. You are gonna have to be able, because what I want to try and do is for people that struggle with that to try and help them learn how to do it. 

[00:57:08] Yeah. 

[00:57:09] To give them place where they can practice that shit and they can get things wrong and they can say offensive stuff and everyone goes, don't worry, it's all right. Maybe 

[00:57:18] say it like that or maybe not call her a C word first. Do you know what I mean? But it's also somewhere where if you want to message the page, it's only me and Jo that's gonna have control or the group. It's only me and Jo that are gonna be admins in there. No one else will see it.

[00:57:31] You can post anonymously, which I think is a brilliant thing, by the way, for groups now. No screenshotting people's shit. No sharing outside of that. But that is somewhere where I am. I am definitely gonna do more things because there's a couple of things that I'm really good at that I want to start sharing with other people and helping other people if they want it.

[00:57:54] And there's lots of things I'm shit at. But I don't know how that's gonna grow. I don't know how that's gonna look in a year's time, but right now that's what I feel like I want to do. I want to be helping where I can, I want people to have a space to 

[00:58:06] talk. Let's talk. Yeah. 

[00:58:08] Jo : So Dizzy is saying good first podcast ladies.

[00:58:12] Thank you. Invite me to the group. Sounds like your group chat on WhatsApp. If it is anything goes and we do not judge. 

[00:58:21] Natasha: Can I want to 

[00:58:21] say something about Kerry, that Kerry and Jo that are in here tonight Kirsty might watch this at some point. She's and Dom might be in here tonight. These are four girls that I met through advocating for Michael Jackson back in 2019 on Twitter that, listen, if you are sitting there now hearing that, without knowing any other context to that, and you're thinking, oh no, she don't.

[00:58:42] She don't think he's innocent, does she? Listen, don't start me off on that subject because you'll be schooled, right? You'll be schooled. But that podcast episode will 

[00:58:51] be 12 hours 

[00:58:52] long tonight. Yeah. If you've learned nothing, podcaster thought, I'll come for you because that is my, if that was taught in universities as a degree, I would hold fucking four of them.

[00:59:02] So let's not go there. Anyway, the point is I met these girls doing that on Twitter. We didn't know each other. We were all up the, Twitter names and whatever. Anyway, we've become good friends now. We've been in a group chat for a long time. We talk most days. We are all similar people. We have similar views, same sort of humor, similar sort of life.

[00:59:22] We are very similar in a lot of ways, but we don't always agree, and I can't stress enough how much I love that group because I know. That I can go in that group and I can say, and Jo can say something and I go, mate, listen, I think you're wrong. Or no, I'm not on that. I think this, we never fall out.

[00:59:47] We never fall out. It's the safest place to just for me to be completely myself into, other than, close friends and whatever. I can just say whatever is on my mind and those girls get me and they don't judge and they oh God, I'm actually a little bit choked. I didn't expect that. 'cause they're all fucking assholes at times.

[01:00:07] I'm not gonna lie guys, I'm not gonna big 'em up too much. But no, do you know what I mean? It's so important to have that space and there are so many people right now that don't have that space. So I want to bring that Yeah. To everyone that wants it. If you want it, it's gonna be there. And I will, I promise everybody, I can't promise you won't have moments in there where it pisses you off.

[01:00:30] I promise that it, I will work hard to make sure that stays 

[01:00:37] that place, yeah. 

[01:00:39] Jo : Beth, sad. Great job, ladies. Enjoyed you both on my way home from work Disney, MJ for life, 

[01:00:47] Natasha: always. That's gonna be that'll be a six part Netflix series, podcast series, whatever. That'll be a, that'll be like 24 hours of knowledge if anyone wants to go down that road.

[01:01:00] But no. Lots of topics. It's just, let's just listen. It's open. Let's talk about anything people can ask me anything as well. Message me and ask 

[01:01:07] me anything. 

[01:01:08] Jo : It's the group handle is at. Life's a shit show. That's it. At Life's a Shit show. 

[01:01:16] Natasha: Can I also say this is working titles, guys. Working titles. We had to think of something pretty quick.

[01:01:22] Do you know what life's fucking shit? Look at the state of it. Oh, and Jo, can you whack up a logo? Yeah. So listen, we will polish everything up later on, but Right. We had to do this now because we wanted to talk honestly about where we feel right now, also so that we can't back out. Yeah, because we were like holding hands, like jumping off that cliff today.

[01:01:47] We were like, oh fuck it Can't go back now do you know what? I just want to say thank you to everyone for coming on because it's been good, it's been good to get back. Yeah, it's been good. I feel good. 

[01:01:58] Jo : Really want merch? Knock up a t-shirt. 

[01:02:00] Natasha: What that says. What? Tash fucking talks too much or something. Thank 

[01:02:06] you everyone for being part of it and for participating. 

[01:02:11] Jo : Yeah. Thank you everybody. And we'll see you next time. We don't even know when next time is. 

[01:02:17] I'm sure we'll get through the list of questions 'cause there's a few more that sort of scene setting question.

[01:02:22] I'd really like people to give us feedback in any form of that's comments on Facebook posts or private messages or if you've got my number, like WhatsApp me or whatever. But give me feedback on this idea of having this kind of place to go and any ideas you've got for what you would like to see or what you don't, you feel you don't have be really, 'cause we are figuring this out as we go along.

[01:02:49] We're just winging it at this point. 

[01:02:50] We'll see you next time. If I come back.